Travis County Commissioners Court
Tuesday, August 31, 2010,
Item 3
Number 3. Receive comments on variance requests under chapter 62 and chapter 64 of the travis county code by synagro of texas - cdr, inc., for a proposed sewage sludge beneficial use land application site. Is that synagro? Cdr, inc., for a proposed sewage sludge beneficial use land application site. For the record i'm tom webber with t.n.r. Sewage sludge, i will lay out a couple of things here before we take public comment on this matter. Sewage sludge is a byproduct from typical wastewater treatment that removes solids from the sewage so it's clear and high quality wastewater can be produced that's suitable for discharge. The sludge is then further treated through -- through anaerobic or aerobic digestion for thickening. Then sites protected from the public like this one, sludge cannot exceed specific standards for toxic metals and pathogens. The proposal by synagro identifies that sewage sludge from the city of austin would be received at the proposed site near garfield for land application. All the sewage sludge generated by the city of austin originates at the walnut creek and south austin regional treatment facilities and then it goes over to hornsby bend for further processing. It's -- it's then -- then produces either a class b product for land application or disposal or a class a product, which would have unrestricted use and that would be unrestricted use by the public. Things like dillo dirt. Typically, in land application, sewage sludge is in a semisolid form and it would be spread on top of the land surface using farm machinery. Sewage sludge is a beneficial substitute for inorganic fertilizers to promote a cover crop for animal grazing or hay production or things of that nature. Synagro proposals to apply class b sewage sludge on 435 acres in southeast travis county near garfield and east of navarro creek road. Tceq has already approved one of three applications by synagro to land apply the sludge. There's hearing requests -- at least the latest information that i had, there's hearing requests on the other two application that's that agency will be considering. As proposed, the travis county commissioners would need to approve of two variance requests before the county development permit could be approved. T.n.r. Does recommend approval of the variances. I have just -- just a couple of photographs here of -- so you can kind of see where this land is. And see if this -- this should shoot -- there you go. This is the north tract, which is off highway 71 near garfield. We also -- we also have another tract which i'm referring to as the south tract. You can see dry creek in the background where there's the higher tree line and this -- so this is the south tract that's basically going to be used for pasturing. Of animals. In terms of the variances, this was in your backup here, but i'll get a couple of diagrams up here. First here we have a -- we have a -- coming -- not coming up for some reason. There we go. Well, we're not going to be able to do that. But in your backup, there we go. This is -- this is something here that -- that -- that -- if you had -- if you did not approve variances from the -- from the floodplain, you would -- you would you would see a substantial amount of the tracks would not be available for land application. In the blue hatching is the buffer that that tceq requires which is 200 feet from a water course. What you see in kind of the pink is -- is what the buffer would be based on the travis county regulations, which is -- which is 500 feet outside of the 100 year floodplain. So you can see down near the bottom of this photo that -- that the south tract would -- would fairly be eliminated. From sludge applications in large parts of the north tract.
>> what -- the acreage that -- that would -- if the variances were not allowed because we're talking about the more than 400-acres, that we are looking at as far as the application being applied for the -- as far as the sludge is concerned, but if the variances were not in place by travis county today, how much of this tract would be -- would be -- of the 400 some odd acres there, how much of that would be covered. As far as what they will be able to use to apply the sludge. We have not computed the acreage, per se, with or without the variance. What i can tell yous the -- is the combination of both the lands owner variance and the floodplain variance, there would be very little land left. And --
>> right. So --
>> so i think if you look at these -- if you combine these two variances, if you combine the two variances, the sheets -- if you can super impose them over one another, you could see there would be very little land left for this site. What -- what we proposed on the floodplain variance, is -- is that -- is that we not -- that we allow sewage sludge not to be applied within 200 feet of the waterways in the north parcels. Similar to what tceq is going to require. And that we -- that we prohibit the application within 300 feet of the parcels on the south track. The south track has more substantial aquatic resources. I think an additional 100 feet buffer would be appropriate there. And also that 300 feet is -- is similar to the requirements of setbacks from -- from development that -- that -- that we require in our other regulations. And then just -- just to finish this, we have -- we have -- if you -- if the land -- there's important things that i wanted to mention on this landowner variance. The -- the requirement in the travis county code is 1500 feet. From the sludge application to an individual residence. We have -- we have -- we have plotted the residence within 1500 feet here. The ones in green up here would be within the 1500 feet. In the case of -- in the case of -- in the case of five of those dots, the -- we have -- there are affidavits that the landowner submitted to tceq indicating that they are okay with having the sewage sludge that close. The -- the last one over -- the one furthest to the right on this photo, we have actually received a protest. On that matter. From a mrs. -- mrs. Caldwell. And her residence, from my estimation, is about 1400 feet away from the closest part of that land application area. So she's -- she would almost be out of the -- out of the -- out of the -- of the area that would require a -- a variance. Now, down here, near the southeastern part of the tract, we put that -- we put that one dot in green. But it's actually -- it's actually synagro has proposed to actually not have a variance for this corner of the property, having heard from a lot of residents in this area that they didn't want this application to be that close to them. And so -- so basically the closest residence would be 1500 or greater feet away from what they're proposing to do. So basically if you see that arc of pink there, they are proposing not to land apply sludge there and adhere the travis county requirement without a variance. All the red dots are people who have either sent us their signature on a petition or they have submitted a letter on their own indicating opposition to this proposal.
>> were they notified -- were the residents notified of this particular item being placed on today's agenda?
>> yes, as a matter of fact i was just going to finish up here with what we did for public notice on this matter.
>> right.
>> there were signs posted in two locations, one of them on navarro creek road and another one on richards drive which is north of the tract. And -- and given information on how to get additional information or submit comments. Land owners of record within 1500 feet were provided written notice. After t.n.r. Prepared a recommendation, the landowners and all of the additional persons who had expressed interest and responded to the first notice received a second notice, which indicated the date today of the public hearing. The -- the opportunity to provide comments and the deadline of september 4th, to provide any additional written comments. We sent that notice in both english and spanish. T.n.r. Not requesting action today. I believe it was item 18. We ask that that be continued for at least one week. So that -- so that the full 30 days of public notice can occur before you take action. Representatives of synagro are here today, also i believe there are some individuals who would like to address you, but they are -- but i am available for any questions.
>> that's benefit the history of this beneficial use, beneficial use permit and stuff like that. I -- been many instances that we have looked at different -- different type of questions that come before the court. Of course this is in precinct 4, which is actually commissioner gomez's precinct. But i recall when we even began with the floodplain ordinances and all of these other kind of things that we have come up with, we have worked very hard to make sure that beneficial use is something that we have to really look at and do things partially. I understand there have been a couple of notices of violations according to my sources for this particular company. I really don't know the magnitude of those violations. But
>> [indiscernible] is something -- odor is something that i understand may be attributed to those violations. My whole point is odor driven winds, just like the odor driven winds on the landfill off of 290, a lot of folks having it up to here in odors. So this is another element that i think need to be considered. I notice that you did say this is class b to a class a. Another way the city of austin of getting rid of its sludge. Sludge. And of course -- of course i guess commissioner gomez also speaks to that. I just want to make sure that -- that staff understands that it's been a long struggle dealing with british use permits as they come -- beneficial use permits as they come through here as far as sludge and other things that we have looked at in the past in this particular subject matter. So i want to make mindful these variances may not be the right way to go. I'm just bringing it to your attention, thank you.
>> any comments from the representatives of -- of synagro? If so, please on come forward. Give us your name, i would be happy to get your comments. Yes, sir?
>> my name is greg rock, i'm the tech services manager for synagro and i'm the one that's been working with mr. Webber as far as the variance request and one of the most important things that i want the court to understand is that -- is that -- and the -- the public that -- that's either opposing it or whatever, that we are not building a wastewater treatment facility at these sites. And i think, in some of the letters that went out, including from tceq and from travis county, that was first thought it was a wastewater treatment plant being built at these land application sites. That is not the case. We are working with the city of austin and assisting them in disposing of this material in a beneficial use program. So i -- that's -- that's the only thing that i really wanted to say to make sure that everybody is clear that we're not building a wastewater treatment facility at these land application sites.
>> where are you --
>> when you say beneficial use, you mean what?
>> beneficial use is just recycling of the organic material and replenishing the soil. Adding nutrients back to the soil. Assisting the grass in growing. Help production of hay, healthier cattle. You know, that's the beneficial use that we are --
>> what do you do to control the odor?
>> the odor? We don't have anything to control the odor. It does have a slight odor to it, but usually dissipates within a couple of days. The process that it goes through is how the odor comes.
>> how often are applications made?
>> at these sites they will be made once a week. We spread the maerials on the fields, set rates yearly to apply the material.
>> so the odor goes way way.
>> within a couple of days.
>> after application. Is that documented somewhere.
>> they have had studies before. It doesn't link.
>> share those studies with mr. Web sneer where is your company based.
>> houston, texas.
>> out of houston, texas. So you just only use the sludge from -- from south austin regional, which is a city wastewater facility, out there in walnut creek, which is another city of austin, wastewater facility, of course they are attributed to all of that kind of operation. But -- but is that the only -- is that the only intake that you will have is just dealing with this particular -- particular sludge from the city of austin or was there -- would there be other -- other sludge -- sludge applications that will be coming in from other sources, other than just the city of austin?
>> at this time, it's just the city of austin.
>> but there may be opportunities for you to deal with -- with other -- in other words, there may be opportunities that would be presenting itself for you to bring in sludge from other -- from other entities other than the city of austin.
>> that is a possibility.
>> possibility. That's what i want. I know that you mentioned earlier. This is what my concern is. You mentioned earlier about the different classes, class a and class b as far as treatment of the sludge. Now my question to you everybody may not be using the same standard when you import sludge from the city of austin. There may not be as much as a process to treat this sludge as -- as maybe the city of austin may have may do. So that -- i'm having some -- i'm wrestling with that, too, because it opens up a door for a whole lot of other avenues of input into this particular acreage. Of course, i'm concerned about the floodplain. I'm concerned about the reason why we did what we did when we came up with the chapter 62 and a whole bunch of these other things. I have a lot of concerns. So i hope that you understand where i'm coming from.
>> any other comments?
>> no, that's it, judge. For me.
>> commissioner eckhardt?
>> sir, i'm sorry, i didn't catch your name, tell me again.
>> my name is greg rock.
>> mr. Rock. I noticed that there were a couple of -- of -- of issues in the compliance history, can you describe to us what the nature of those -- of those citations were? I believe they were notices of violations but then they were administratively handled.
>> right. Um ...
>> i want to put this in context. It has many pluses, but also from an environmental perspective has some minuses, mostly in that tceq probably although we're going to find out exactly how many they have, but the last that i checked woefully inadequate in staffing levels to make sure that beneficial land application is truly beneficial not just dumping sludge. Sounds like what you all are doing is truly beneficial. An annual application. Could you tell me how quickly after the application is tilled into the soil.
>> is it tilled in?
>> uh-huh no.
>> no. It's just land applied, surface applied. It's not discked in or tilled in. Just -- just it goes on the ground and then retained moisture it will soak down into the soil. No till is -- is being --
>> have you found the spot in your records --
>> okay. The notice of the violations that we had was in one of -- from one of our land application sites. It was an odor issue from one of the -- one of the -- -- the people that claimed that the odor came from -- from one of the waste -- one of the wastewater treatment plants. But we have no proof that it actually came from that particular plant when they said they had other odors in the area also. So -- so that was -- we did double check with our plant to see if anything out of the ordinary happened. It wasn't anything out of the ordinary. Out of the ordinary smell that -- that was -- that was -- but tceq just investigated because they were called to -- a lot of people are not comfortable with what we did out there.
>> where is that?
>> it was out in colorado county, around the eagle lake area.
>> there was one other notice of violation?
>> oh, yeah.
>> you had two violations.
>> that was in november of '08, the other one that i have listed here is november of '05. That was -- that was unauthorized source brought to this site. It was -- it was -- it was just caught in -- in -- this was a little bit before my time, it's hard to explain what happened there. I'm just kind of reading the same thing that you are reading. It was a source not approved from the tceq not hauled out to the application site. No harm was done, i think from what i understand, after the test that came back showed that that material was okay for land application. Just got out to the field before it actually got approved by tceq.
>> what county was that.
>> waller.
>> they have to submit documentation on the quality of the sludge and other things and have explicit approval from tceq first.
>> uh-huh.
>> and i know that we will not be taking action today. Who would we contact in -- in synagro regarding -- regarding synagro's position on increased -- increased staffing levels at tceq? The reason why i bring it up, what we found was industrial users in close proximity to residential users is that it is -- it is much most benefit, frankly to the industry as well, to have an adequate monitoring system in place, so that for instance in the colorado county incident, it appears that synagro's position was that the odor wasn't theirs. But of course without -- without adequate monitoring system to know what's going on out there, it becomes he said she said of industrial -- of industrial neighbors.
>> right.
>> so who at synagro would we contact with regard to a letter of support for -- for a higher degree of monitoring. So that your industry could prove up its benefits and -- compatibility with neighboring uses. Tell us your name.
>> my name is chuck simmons. I'm a senior of technical services manager for synagro, and i cover texas. Under that.
>> do you know how many -- how many inspectors tceq has working in the field on -- on -- on beneficial sludge applications permits. Looking at lapped base, we do -- land base and we do permit it, so that the land base is visually inspected by tceq.
>> how often.
>> well, right before we get the permit or before they start administrative work on the permit they come to the field and look at it. Then i believe it's once a year they do inspections on all land base that we have in the state of texas. Do they do the inspection -- do they time the inspection around the -- since you are only going to be doing the beneficial land application once a year, it appears that it would be -- most beneficial for that inspection to occur around the time or -- or at the time or just after the application.
>> yes, ma'am.
>> when do they do the annual inspections?
>> it's just -- just any time during the year. I mean, there's no -- there's no certain time, they just give us notice. And --
>> so -- sometimes, commissioner, they do want to come out and see when the activity is actually going on. Then other times we've had them where they just came out, there was no activity going on at all. So it's -- so it's happened both ways in my experience.
>> what is the -- what is the -- what is the breadth of the inspection?
>> do they just come out look, take soil samples.
>> no, they don't take soil samples. They come up and visually inspect. I know one thing they look at is the buffer areas to make sure that you are not applying material within, you know, a restricted area and those areas, if -- if -- if at the time of application and they are doing the inspection, those areas will be flagged so they want to see that those flags are in the proper areas.
>> how would they know if you were beneficially applying beyond your -- inside your buffer zone.
>> how would they know?
>> how would they know?
>> well, they could see that.
>> they could see it visually, detection?
>> i mean, those flags stay up for the duration of the -- of the -- of the -- of the application.
>> so they are relying on the flags?
>> yes.
>> based on flags placed by the -- by the actual regulated entity?
>> yes.
>> by synagro.
>> yes. Those flags, you know, have to be a at certain distances distances, you know, on the buffers, which those measurements are done, excuse me, with a measuring wheel. Also with the laser range finder.
>> i ask these questions of y'all as the -- as the people on the ground actually doing this.
>> right, well, i understand.
>> and i don't want to punish an industry that has a -- has a very high probability of being both a green disposition of our trash.
>> yes, ma'am.
>> and also a benefit to our agricultural industry. But at the same time, i am very concerned about what appears to me to be exceedingly lax monitoring by tceq.
>> well, other things, ma'am, that -- that and greg does a lot of permitting here exclusively in texas, but -- but it's pretty strange permit process.
>> the permitting process, i'm more concerned about the monitoring after the permit is provided. At the end of the year we provide tceq with an annual report on all land application. Results of soil samples for the 503 metals and/or -- and a -- and nutrients. And we send that report to them every year. Also, the time that that report is done, we take those soil analysis and take the nutrient parts and recalculate our rates for the following year, to make sure that we are -- that we are applying it at agrinomic rates.
>> i hugely appreciate that. I -- as -- as an attorney, i'm -- i was in the unfortunate position, although an understandable position, of -- of being involved in the prosecution of a sludge hauler who was not as assidious in their reporting or not as assidious in the types of sludge they were hauling and supposedly beneficially applying. There was actually not much benefit.
>> there's some of those around.
>> there are some of those around. So i know that you can appreciate that -- that i -- i would want to keep the bar high.
>> yes, ma'am.
>> and -- and who at synagro would be -- would we contact for a letter of support for -- for -- to ask them whether or not they would be willing to do a letter of support to tceq for increased inspection and monitoring of -- in order to keep that bar high.
>> your contact would be me. What i would do would send that to our corporate -- corporate representative actually here in houston.
>> okay.
>> but, yes, i'm -- i mean your contact will be me.
>> that would be great, i appreciate it.
>> i would be glad to give you my address and all of my numbers after this.
>> that would be fantastic.
>> thank you, mr. Rock and mr. Simmons.
>> yes, sir, thank you.
>> we are posted for a public hearing. If you are here on this item and would like to give comments at this time, please come forward. One person has signed in. That is -- that is ms. Torres or mr. Torres. Please have a seat there. Anybody else here on this item who wishes to give comments? If so, please come forward. We have actually three chairs available. After mr. Rock and mr. Simmons leave. But they can stay right where they are if nobody else plans to give comments. This is not the time to be shy. This is the time to come forth, be bold and efficient. Who else is here to give comments on this item? Okay. Ms. Torres?
>> good morning.
>> good morning.
>> i'm here to --
>> ms. Rock, mr. Simmons, we do need those two chairs. Thanks for getting real comfortable. If we need you back up here, we'll call you, okay.
>> okay.
>> thank you.
>> two seats available. Come up, ms. Torres.
>> good morning.
>> torres. To beg the people in charge of making this decision to please keep in mind there are over 60 families in that neighborhood. Navarro creek alone. That we have children and -- and a lot more that are being born right now. They are really sick, they have and his marks i've had two children who have -- cancer. We have issues with flooding in that area. We can't even leave our streets because it's like a little chris that crosses in two parts of the street. We are stuck there. All of these issues that are happening and -- in our neighborhood. We don't feel it's fair, because we own the properties already. A lot of people have bought their properties or have been living there for over 10 years. 15 years. So -- so we don't feel like we're being heard as far as we don't want the odor because we already have a cattle ranch in that area, already produces odors, flies, other issues that our kids can't like my child is asthmatic, he can't be outside sometimes because of the odors that are already out there. If this comes into play, he won't be able to -- to do what he has to do. To do exercise and whatever to keep himself healthy because he can't be outside. Even smoke that are people burning in the area, he can't be outside. I'm really concerned because -- because a lot of these people like -- like the gentleman, mr. Rock, mr. Simmons, they don't live in the area. They are not going to have to put up with this thing. We are, we already own the property, who is going to want to, you know, come and live in a place that -- that this is happening continuously. I've even spoken to the u.t. School of nursing,ment program director, that -- there in dell valley because my children have been sick for five years. They don't know where it's coming from. They don't understand some of the reasons why they get so sick, so often. They are even wanting more monitoring of air quality, water, things like that in that area. A lot of our people that we live out there are very low income families. Barely making it as it is. So we feel like we don't have a voice with this coming in. With these big corporations coming in and deciding. So we are very angry and -- and really resenting the fact that why do we have to put up with this. I spoke to mr. Webber on the phone to ask him questions about odor. Also about who would benefit financially from this. And he was very evasive as far as answers, he wasn't able to give me a clearance of who was going to be beneficial, financial benefits were going to be happening for a few. Also -- also we don't really understand in the long run what kind of effect this is going to have on our children, what kind of effect we're going to have on our property. Really is it going to increase or decrease the value of our properties. So there's just a lot of concern that's i don't feel are being addressed. A lot of people in our neighborhood are spanish speaking. Some don't -- don't, you know, don't feel comfortable coming and speaking on their behalf because -- because they don't understand the language, they don't understand the law, they don't understand what benefits or -- or what, you know, hazards could happen to them. So i'm really speaking on behalf of our own neighborhood. We are scared, really upset. We feel like we have our hands tied and, you know, we're just being asked to -- you know, to think because there's nobody is -- has taken into account there's a lot of families there. And we're going to suffer. We're going to have to put up with that. So -- so that's -- i even spoke that to mr. Web, i asked him. If it were happening in your neighborhood, would you allow it. He said well maybe. Well, of course if it's not happening in your neighborhood sure you are going to say maybe. If it's in your neighborhood, he said it couldn't happen in Lakeway, westlake. Of course. It wouldn't happen there because people have the resources the money, the power to be able to not have it happen there. We don't have those things. We don't have any of that. We don't feel like eeven have a voice because this is going to be dropped in our back yard and we're going to have to put up with it, that's it. So like i said i'm just wanting you guys to hear that there's human beings out there that are going to suffer from it.
>> since there have been any -- has there been any opportunity for the neighbors to speak with synagro in an english spanish description of --
>> everything --
>> land application.
>> no, ma'am, i'm sorry. Everything has been pain paper. A lot of the spanish translation i will be frank with you, i speak fluent spanish and english. I cannot understand half of the stuff that's on there myself. So i'm going to be very clear on that. The two letters that i have gotten, some of the stuff cannot be understood my a spanish speaking person. Let alone a very little educated spanish speaking person because the spanish is not correct spanish.
>> what is your water source outlet there.
>> garfield water supply.
>> water friday corporation.
>> > thank you, ms. Torres. Your name.
>>
>> [indiscernible] maria.
>>
>> [speaking in spanish]
>> she's trying to say she agrees with what i just mentioned. A lot of mothers there having small children. We're concerned about their health. What's going to happen with them.
>> he has lived there 25 years, right now loves the place, we really enjoy living there, but even right now we are having odors coming from the 973 area where they are dumping. With the winds it comes even up to our properties, that's a pretty good distance away. More than the synagro would be. Already concerns from that smell and what effects it could have on our health.
>>
>> [speaking in spanish] zoo.
>> with the hornsby plant that's there, we are already getting a lot of the smells coming to our area. With this, we're going to be pack understand the middle, in between two odors happening continually. We're concerned about how are we going to able to live in those areas. Most of us have five or more acres on that road alone, navarro creek. How can we enjoy our properties outside and with our children if we're continually bombarded by smells on either side of our property. That we don't want that to occur in our neighborhood. We really beg you we don't want it there at all.
>> thank you.
>> thank you.
>> how does she spell her last name.
>> reyes.
>> oh, okay. Thank you. How much sludge are we talking about being applied here on this particular 400 some odd acre tract, from the city of austin, and i would also like to know who else is the city using to -- to dispose of its sludge? Now, they have -- they have apparently looking at these folks here, but of course they have to go through the process as far as beneficial use permit, of course this is something that comes up --
>> jot those questions down, mr. Webber.
>> i need to get an answer for that. How much are we talking about, are we talking about tons of it, how many? And who else, the city of austin is using to dispose of its accumulation of sludge at the south austin regional and also the walnut creek wastewater treatment plant. We need to know that because we've had a lot of struggles with beneficial use permits being applied east of i-35. No doubt about it.
>> two questions for you.
>> thank you.
>> yes.
>> my name is jasmin aguilar, i'm with them. I think about
>> [indiscernible] torres, ms. Reyes, too, i'm concerned about my two kids, too. The odor all of that. I know the environment is contamination. But -- but i would like to be more -- less than my family. My family is there, too. We live there almost for 15 years. And we own the property like she said. With them, please, i'm begging to you, i don't want that project to be in. I'm just concerned about my two kids, you know, i want pretty good health -- you know, i understand that we're all around, you know -- you know, bad odors and contaminations, but if we can -- if we can be less, you know, i would appreciate it. That's my thinking. You know. And i'm -- i spoke of my family, too, my parents are here. They don't speak english but, you know, they -- my dad is really old and my mom is going through there, too. My dad is 65. And, you know, he's got a lot of --
>> by the way, 65 is not very old.
>> [laughter]
>> i'm sorry.
>> [laughter] i'm sorry, i didn't mean to --
>> [laughter]
>> good deal judge.
>> i'm sorry. But i'm just speaking with my dad, too, and consider his health, too. So -- so i'm with them and i'm begging to, you know, i don't want the project to be there, too.
>> what are the other sources of odor in your neighborhood?
>> from the hornsby bend?
>> the hornsby -- the ranch.
>> the ranch?
>> yes. That's pretty far away from us. The hornsby bend plant. But at night you can have that smell came all the way up to our properties.
>> yeah.
>> i remember when my sister got her wedding, we did a party. And we thought it was our septic, you know, and we check and everything and i don't know from where, it would smell really bad. And because it was -- it was really windy and we didn't know where to come from and we thought, you know, the ranch and we have 973, also. So -- so it's really bad sometimes. I mean really bad. And it gets like for two or three days. Nothing we can do. Just smell. Nothing we can do. But please i don't want that project to be -- i mean --
>> thank you.
>> i don't want it in our area.
>> mr. Priest.
>> thank you, judge, commissioners, morris priest, speaking on my own behalf. The county -- the county giving a variance of -- to their codes, apply sewage, floodplains and less than 1500 feet of residence i think is appalling. Just as appalling as what we saw with txi. We have -- we have no way of knowing who is going to be responsible for anything out there. Applications. Twice weekly, we see odors are going to last a couple of days, but they are going to continually be going out there. So it will be a never ending barrage of odor and, you know, we see in the statesman today in the legal notices with the -- with the water district talking about these things, north austin water district, knowing that they don't have a water district, knowing that they don't have the legal -- the legal protections that other people in the county have. Nor the political support. We're at the mercy of -- of the e.p.a. And tceq and this county court, which all three have proven to be very poor and in dealing with situations like this. And i just, you know, i can only say that i ask
>> [indiscernible] vote against this, i have zero confidence in the fact that you will. Thank you.
>> thank you for those encouraging words, mr. Priest.
>> [laughter]
>> anybody else to give comments during this public hearing before we hear answers to questions from mr. Webber? Last opportunity to give comments on this matter. Mr. Webber, if you would answer those two questions of commissioner davis asked and i will have one other question regarding the process.
>> one of the questions was i think basically where does austin, besides this place, take its sewage sludge. The primary thing that i think they try to do is to -- to process the sewage sludge at hornsby bend to the extent that it could be a class a product. And bagged. Or in bulk form sold as dillo dirt which has unrestricted use. Talking to them just last week, they can't -- they don't have the capacity of those operations to -- to use all of their sludge and do a class a product, so they rely on a class b disposition for this. They -- they told me they have a -- they have an existing contract with synagro to take -- to take this class b sludge to la grange in the la grange area, i guess fayette county somewhere a site. And then also they -- they ultimately have the opportunity to just send it to the landfill, which is -- which is perhaps the safest place for it. But it doesn't do anything of course in terms of -- of -- of decreasing or -- doesn't do anything to eliminate the capacity issues that you have with landfill space. And -- and but it's certainly a way to kind of put it away and keep it away from -- from exposure pathways. In terms of -- in terms of how much sludge would be land applied, i -- i would have to go back to my records and get you the answer on the exact number of tons. But they have a -- they have a rate of tons per acre, which can be applied to the extent that it can support cover crop. If you put too much sewage sludge on there, you are not going to -- it's not going to be beneficial. You are going to -- you are going to kill the crop. It will be too strong of a nutrient content. Not to mention, you know, just sort of smothering what's below. If -- if -- so these -- these application rates are -- are established based on the actual soil types there and the cover crop. So that you don't have -- essentially too much nitrogen being input into the soil. That's -- that's generally the most -- the most restrictive thing is the nitrogen. In the case of city of austin sewage sludge, the heavy metals are quite low so that probably wouldn't be a limiting factor in terms of the rate that they could apply the sewage sludge.
>> class b is the one that we obtains the odor -- retains the odor. The class a being the dillo dirt type of process that's actually taken on by the hornsby bend wastewater treatment facility. Off of 973. But the class b is what we are really talking about here today.
>> that's correct.
>> and i need more information on the class b. Especially that they are hauling, they have a contract, if i'm understanding the city of austin has a contract with these folks to also deal with taking it somewhere out of county. Of course, part of the challenge that we have heard and we will continue to hear is the -- the bad stuff going east of i-35. You know, it's -- it continues to happen and -- and i can understand what these folks are talking about here. So -- so that's another -- another situation where the folks have to deal with that. So class b is a -- is the worst of the two. As far as sludge is concerned.
>> it --
>> thank you.
>> yes.
>> now, we have the authority to -- to reject the -- the request for two grievances. I mean two variances.
>> yes. There's --
>> if we do that, it means a smaller operation, not necessarily that it will go away.
>> that's -- that's correct.
>> but it may be too small to proceed.
>> that would probably be up to the company to determine if it was still viable.
>> okay.
>> at that point.
>> okay. You have phone numbers for mr. Rock and mr. Simmons.
>> i do.
>> in case we -- any additional questions, please give them to mr. Webber, he will try to get the answers unless you want the phone numbers you can deal directly with the two representatives of the applicant who came today. We will have this on the court's agenda again next week. One week or two weeks?
>> one week would be fine.
>> and we would plan to take action and what we will do is put on the agenda what time we will call this item up next week and we will do our best to stick to it.
>> and, judge, we -- we cannot force synagro to do this, but i would strongly suggest a public meeting in english and spanish with synagro officials and the neighbors to describe what you do.
>> okay.
>> if that takes place, let us know, there's no reason to put it on the agenda if they are planning to meet, unless they have met already. Okay. If we have it on, i'm -- hopefully we will take action. All right?
>> yes, sir.
>> move that the public hearing be closed.
>> okay.
>> all in favor? That passes by unanimous vote.
The Closed Caption log for this Commissioners Court agenda item is provided by Travis County Internet Services. Since this file is derived from the Closed Captions created during live cablecasts, there are occasional spelling and grammatical errors. This Closed Caption log is not an official record the Commissioners Court Meeting and cannot be relied on for official purposes. For official records please contact the County Clerk at (512) 854-4722.
Last Modified:
Tuesday, August 31, 2010, 2010 2:30 PM
