Travis County Commissioners Court
September 23, 2008
Items 8 & 9
8. Consider and take appropriate action on request to adopt order setting the Travis County tax rates for the year beginning January 1, 2008: 1. Total maintenance and operations tax rate; 2. Total debt service tax rate; and 3. Total county ad valorem tax rate so c will be a combination of a and b. And do we need to go ahead and just call up 9 to take them together?>/p>
>> we can, yes, sir.
9. Consider and take appropriate action on request to adopt order approving the Travis County budget for fiscal year 2009. We do have several residents who have come down. Is there something new and different than we heard during the public hearing? So we can take the residents first or what?
>> no, sir. We can do the residents.
>> if you have come to give comments regarding the Travis County tax rate or the budget. This is your opportunity to address the Commissioners court. If you come forth, we have three chairs there and as one person completes his or her statement, we would -- if we could have that seat we will have another one come forth.
>> thank you, thanks, judge. Sorry we couldn't hear you earlier in the morning. My name is don zimmerman, coming to you this morning as a Travis County taxpayer and I would like to thank the court for hearing us today. I want to urge action from the Commissioners court, I would like everyone to support Gerald Daugherty's attempt to hold the line on out of pocket taxes. I think that's what most of the people here with me and people that have come on their own are just really want to plead with you to hold the line on taxes. I know your cost have increased but of course all of the taxpayers are facing the same increases. You know when I moved here eight years ago, my taxes were about, my out of pocket taxes were about one-half of what they are now. I came here in the internet bubble. I bought this suit back when I was making money in the internet bubble. I heard about the salamander here, I had no idea who the Barton Creek salamander was. I have come to appreciate how lucky this creature is. He has amazing property rights. More than I do. He gets property rights and has no property tax bill. This is just amazing to me. So I don't know if I'm going to have any luck turning myself into a salamander so get my property rights without a property tax bill. But I am wondering how to pay the extra expense. If you vote to raise the taxes, you know, the money is going to have to come out of our taxpayers from somewhere. So I have been hearing a lot on the news about newly created jobs. I'm a software engineer. The economy for software engineers really hasn't come back since the internet bubble collapsed about six years ago. I am going to try to take one of these newly created jobs and as you see from my sign, we have a lot of these people here in the Austin area. Says will work to pay taxes, anything will help, god bless. Seriously, guys, we have some economic trouble here in Travis County. And I really want to urge you to please hold the line on out of pocket tax increases. That's all that I've got. Thank you.
>> thank you.
>> thank you, mr. Zimmerman.
>> [ applause ]
>> I'm pat jackson and I certainly want to echo what don has said. But I have some other things on my own, too. That is what in any period of time over the generations, everybody as individuals and any government has to consider the fact that there is inflation, has to consider that particularly. Now we are having troubles because of the, you know, the gas and oil situation and other things going on. So we -- we all have to worry about it. The problem is that you all are the ones that have to make some really tough decisions. And certainly the citizens appreciate the fact that you have these tough decisions to make. But -- but it just -- just like individuals had to tighten their belts, they can't go get, you know, coffee from starbucks, they can't go and do -- go out to eat every night when they have to tighten their belts. There has got to be ways for government to do the same. The problem is that you have individual groups who are saying we want more, we want more. And all of the people around there saying please don't do any more. They normally don't talk to you. So, you know, you usually take care of the squeaky wheel. What I'm asking you is please recognize even if the wheel isn't squeaking from the average citizen, they are hurting. So it's important for you all to say look at how we can sharpen our budget better. What more can we do to lower the cost so that the public, particularly at this time doesn't have to worry about it. They are already having a tight situation. The county does not need to add to their woes. Please figure out ways to be more efficient. New ways of doing things, more ways to get things done for less money. Whatever you need to do, figure out a way to sharpen your pencils and cut the budget so that you do not need to raise the tax rate as much as you are thinking that you are going to have to. So -- so I -- I appreciate, a lot of people appreciate you all spending all of these hours over, you know, so long so it's not that we're saying oh, you're terrible people. We are just saying please recognize that the individual citizens who are not here are -- are really hurting and instead of taking the squeaky wheel and taking care of that, take care of these people. It's not a case of if we will vote for you next year or whatever your election is up. They will probably not remember which ones voted which ways. But as you got into this thing to help people. This is a good time to really work hard at it. So far as I know, Commissioner Daugherty is the only one who has really been hold the line. I know y'all have been saying to yourself, gee, I sure wish we could. I'm saying think so it again, work harder, thanks a lot.
>> thank you, ms. Jackson. Yes, sir?
>> thank you again, this is ronnie reeferseed. I wanted to reiterate what the two previous speakers have said and that here's your chance. I know we can't all been Gerald Daugherty or can't all agree with him all of the time. As a defenders of the taxpayers in Travis County, I think that he's doing an extraordinarily good estimation of this question in particular and I hope that you all would pay attention to or give it another think about who is really hurting, which is virtually all of us. All of us squeaky wheels or not. So thanks again for your patience.
>> thank you.
>> your honor, Commissioners, my name is rocky hardy, I'm a private business owner here. I'm also a mortgage lender. When it comes to property taxes, I know that for my first-time home buyers, it can mean the difference between affording a certain price range of home or not. When I do a qualification for someone, I take not only consideration their income and their debts, but also their homeowners insurance, their mortgage insurance and their property taxes. When property taxes are rising, then that adds to the debt level. And when you look at underwriting guidelines, 1/100th of a point means you qualify or don't qualify. It's pretty important on a first time home buyer. I know that we have a lot going on in our national finances, we are reading the newspaper all of the time. Going to take between six and nine months for those effects to start hitting main streets. You are going to start seeing higher inflation, you are going to see it affect jobs and everything. I would like to suggest at the local level we anticipate that 6 to 9 months out we are going to start seeing effects down on our level that we look at how we do business and prioritize what we can afford to spend and make the adjustments before we have to. I would rather us be proactive than be reactive. You know, when I work with my clients to help them get to where they can qualify. Sometimes they have to work with them on their budgeting. You have to decide what you can and can't spend. My client can't have everything they want. They often have to pay off debts, I have to work with them on okay here's our priorities, here's how we pay them off. Let's get your credit aligned, let's get your finances where you qualify for a mortgage that's going to be healthy for you, it's not going to send you into bankruptcy, foreclosure, divorce. I would like to request that as -- the county Commissioners, I know that it's a tough call, but please be honest with the public on what we can and can't do. Let's try to get the public in line with what we have to do to keep our costs down so that we're not overburdened with the property taxes that are going to affect us all. I support Commissioner Daugherty's initiatives to keep things in line. I also support all of the other precinct Commissioners and everybody in Travis County to do the same thing. I support you all, thank you very much.
>> I'm mark phillips, george. I'm a homeowner in south Austin, I would strongly suggest that we hold the line on property taxes. The lower income people are -- well, everyone is feeling the effects of the massive increase prices of food and fuel, we also I think are going to have an increase in trash collection fees. And -- and I just think it would be very good to hold the line right now. I think that there -- their cumulative effects of the increase in taxes, it not just the Commissioners court, but everything combined is -- I think it's possibly pushing more people into foreclosure and I think that I would hope that you strongly consider holding the line on taxes. Thank you.
>> thank you.
>> my name is colin doneigan. I believe we should abolish property taxes. I believe there should be approved a different way to get funds, but I do not believe people should have to pay taxes for owning property. I would hope that you can find other ways to maybe raise taxes and -- and I'm sorry this is my first time here.
>> that's okay.
>> here to speak my mind because I live a
>> [indiscernible] life, things are going well for me. I see a lot of people that are complaining about not being able to -- to live in their homes or afford their property taxes. I think for those people we should really look out for them and try our best to abolish property tax or at least work towards those directions, thank you.
>> thank you.
>> good morning, my name is christian jones. I moved into northeast Travis County. I bought a -- I thought I bought a house in bastrop. You all wanted me back because I was annexed back in Travis County somehow. Anyway that's what gives me the right to speak with you this morning. I'm here to represent my neighbors and friends in elgin who are paying outrageous property taxes already and a neighbor of mine is a farmer. He and his family pay more than $20,000 a year. In property taxes. Actually, I'm afraid to tell them about your vote. I think that he might have a heart attack. But it's -- people are hurting. He's not going to be able to pay what you guys decided.
>> the tax rate is actually lower and he gets an ag exemption.
>> he does have an ag exemption.
>> they have been there 100 years. They own a couple hundred acres and have four homes on their property. They are not making enough money to spend more than $20,000 a year on property taxes. As you know farmers are being crunched. The fuel prices are outrageous. He's taking loans out to stay in business. I have friends who are artists and musicians in Austin who bought their homes 30 years ago and paid them off and now their property taxes are more than their mortgages. That's something that you guys need to think about when you are making these decisions. Because I'm working as a young professional. Watching people my parents age and my grandparents age spending into oblivion, into debt. I don't think that that's fair. You know, I'm watching you guys spending our money, it's a debt load that we're not going to be able to carry. So as you look at your budgets, and we tighten our belts, I don't see why you can double the rate beyond population growth and inflation. I mean Daugherty is the only one who spoke against that. I think when you go to bed tonight hopefully you can think about that. That's why I came in here today so I could sleep tonight, thank you.
>> christian, please know I appreciate, I can see how emotional this is for you. We are not doubling the rate. I mean, the tax rate is sort of confusing to understand to average everyday person. It was for me before I got into this. We're not doubling it, I mean, --
>> it's doubling the rate over population growth in inflation, which is twice as much as anyone that I know can handle. It's tough. If you pay your house off and then you have to reason it from the government after your mortgage has been paid, that's communism. You lose your house due to property taxes that is communism.
>> the tax rate is lower than the average home owner is seeing an increase of less than 3% on their taxes.
>> well, my friends who is an artist bought her home in the 70s, she paid $13,000, it's now worth over $400,000, their income has not gone up enough to justify that. They are going to be forced out of their home --
>> you are right about that. The state of Texas evaluates an individual's wealth on the property that they own. I agree with you, that particularly when you are looking at an artist who bought their house 20 years ago, it's a bad proxy for that individual's wealth. I 100% agree with you. It's our state government that requires that we base our tax system on property wealth. Almost exclusively at the county level.
>> it's penalizing the people who shouldn't be penalized.
>> I agree with you.
>> and when they lose their homes because of the property taxes, that's outrageous government. Outrageous government and I want you guys to think about that. I know it's a hard job what you guys do, but you have to rein in spending at the local level. The legislature did promise property tax relief. No one has seen it because the local government is outs of control.
>> our local government's budget predominantly goes to courts, jails, and roads. All of which we cannot do without it.
>> if there's anyplace that's you can cut spending I highly recommend you look into it.
>> I agree.
>> thank you, ms. Jones.
>> thank you. My name is rob wilson, I'm a renter, not a property owner. But my represent is affected by property fax levels, I'm also a professional. Was unemployed. I don't know when or if I'll ever get to be a homeowner because of -- what the mortgage gentleman was talking about a few minimums ago. I understand what you all have been saying. I thank you all for your service to the county. It was funny last month my church had its annual budget meeting, they dropped their budget not by raising it 4% or whatever, but they dropped it to 90% of this past year's level. They fond a way to actually -- found a way not to just reduce the rate of growth but reduce the raw numbers. That's what we all have to do. I'm asking you all to find ways to do what we all have to do. Thank you all very much.
>> thank you.
>>
>> [indiscernible] I'm a homeowner, taxpayer here in Travis County, also have investment properties here in Travis County. I understand that everybody is trying to hold the line on taxes. Myself, too. There's a limited pool of resources and how we allocate those resources, I want to thank you all.
>> [one moment please for change in captioners] he was brought back to life as a result of starflight. I don't want that service to go away. That's where my tax dollars go. There's a collective good we have to keep in mind. Everybody is concerned about their pocketbook, I understand, I appreciate that, no one more than myself, but there is a collective good. This is one of the reasons we spoke about employees and employee compensation. Everybody is trying to survive. Everybody is just trying to make it. It's not fair for the budget to be balanced off of services that we provide that are essential and needed in this county. It's not fair the budget to balance off every citizen in this county. And so we have to keep these things in perspective. We have a limited pool of resources. What are our priorities, how do we allocate those and move forward to where everybody is a win-win situation. Thank you very much.
>> thank you.
>> good morning, I'm jennifer gale speaking on our tax rate decrease, but the net, we're going to have a net increase on our tax. The -- our -- the revenue -- umm, went from 663.5 million last year down to 661.3 this year. So we have less revenue coming in. Clearly we're spending several thousand dollars to pay our taxes and this discussion about a tax rate going down really doesn't help anyone understand how the tax system works. The people -- the reason why people are moving into our state from new york and california is because we don't have any state taxes.
>> income tax.
>> state income tax, right. An income tax taking money out of their paychecks. Whereas we take money out of people's property. So if you finally have enough money to own property, you pay 6 you 7 thousand dollars in taxes and you are not going to be able to own that property, you go into bankruptcy and have then foreclosure on your house and then you commit misdemeanors and felonies and you end newspaper our prison system. I'm saying we need to keep people out of our prison system. And so all the wealthy people that are moving into our state, we should have -- we should make it a state law where our businessmen and businesswomen are actually paying a fair minimum wage, which should be around $23 an hour, or we have to revert to a state income tax. Because the revenue has to come from somewhere. And you heard her, that's -- it's horrific. I can't even imagine having to pay the taxes that we have to pay in our -- specifically in Travis County. So I think we should petition the state legislature for a Texas income tax on our payroll. Thank you.
>> thank you. Anybody else here on items 8 or 9? Anybody else? If so, please come forward. Anything else?
>> no, sir, judge, you have before you the specific wording as required for the motions on 8 a, b and c.
>> on 8 a, what if I move basically to adopt a tax rate of .3394 for maintenance and operations?
>> second.
>> will that get it?
>> the statute specifically states the words that must be used. The words in quotes are the words in the statute.
>> I move that property taxes be increased by the adoption of a tax rate of .3394 for maintenance and operations.
>> second.
>> any discussion?
>> yes, judge. I'd like to just say a couple of things. We've heard a lot of testimony here today. We've gone through a pretty rigorous challenges to try to come up with a budget that we feel will be acceptable here to the public. And believe me, this process, these budget hearings and we have come to looking at ways to set the tax rate and hopefully adopt a budget has been something that has been a struggle and a serious challenge. However, during this process, during this process, we, this court, have individually voted on things to be included in what we're talking about today and voted not to include some things that we're talking here today as far as services whether roads, e.m.s., del valle, the criminal courts, all of these things that have been mentioned are services that we voted for, even f.t.e.s. We've all participated in this, and it's kind of hard to pick and choose one way or the other. We have here a mechanism whereby the participation level for each one of us as court members have been voted on in previous hearings. So this is the result of what we're looking at from those votes. It was not all just a vote against what's happening here today. A vote against what's happened yesterday. A vote for what's happening here today. It's been an either/or and, of course, I voted against some things but I voted for some things, but each one of us has. So I don't want anyone to think it's been a one shoe fit all situation as far as the process of this budget. But I think this more than anything else, folks got to realize that Travis County, an example of a bond rating, triple a bond rating. It is hard to find any governing body in the state of Texas that has a triple a bond rating. I applaud this court for having that type of bond rating, for the way we do things and the way we do business in Travis County. Now, if there are things to cut out, well, you know, we can look and see what needs to be cut, however, those things are in place and we would like to move forward. But nobody specifically has said to me this should be cut out, this should stay, this should go. Where do we go for -- for example, health and human services increased. When we tell the poor people out there, loon, the budget is one million more dollars than last. Where do we start cutting and telling poor people that we can't serve them anymore in this community. We are here to provide a service. And, of course, we are doing it the best we can and even though folks say hold the line on taxes, we understand and we are doing what we can do within the constraint that we have to deal with. We are providing services for Travis County, whether it's our court system, which is mandate on that for us to do things, so I think we have been very cautious and very author active and I think we produced a good product. I don't go into anything else, judge, but thank you.
>> any more discussion? All in favor of the motion? Show Commissioners Gomez, Davis, eckhardt and yours truly voting in favor. Voting against Commissioner Daugherty. In terms of 8 b I move rocks be increased by adoption of a tax rate of .0278 for debt service.
>> second.
>> discussion? All in favor. Show Commissioners Davis, eckhardt, Gomez and yours truly voting in favor. Voting against Commissioner Daugherty. In terms of 8 c if we add b and a,
I move that property taxes be increased by the adoption of a tax rate of .4122 for the combined tax rate.
>> second.
>> discussion? All in favor? Show Commissioners Gomez, eckhardt, Davis and yours truly voting in favor. Commissioner Daugherty voting against.
>> thank you, judge. Regarding item number 9, the total proposed budget for fiscal year 2009 is $661,330,320. There are --
>> we have one motion. It's just kind of a housekeeping cleanup. As you are aware, the court approved during markup the million dollars for the financial system, and those 11 slots in the general fund were actually submitted with the proposed budget in the reserve as the court had approved it. We do want to make a motion to move those slots into the individual departments. Those would be 7 f.t.e.s for the auditor, two for the purchasing department, one in i.t.s. And one in h.r. In the general fund and one in h.r. In fund 526. So we would make that as a motion for the court to approve and we will amend the slot list.
>> so the money is in allocated reserve.
>> that's correct.
>> move approval of the recommendation.
>> second.
>> discussion?
>> just one item in regard to the budget specifically, and I suppose it's in light of the tax rate as well, our budget this year, our budget this year is one that is the result of consensus among all five of us.
>> exactly.
>> it was not an easy budget to put together and it probably will be more difficult next year. We have a efficiency committee in place to find what areas we can achieve a higher level of efficiency and we are already and have been for some time engaged in a process to go to a performance based budget to really look carefully at the experts that we are engaged in because as f.d.r. Said, you got to try something. We've got to try something, and when it doesn't work, we need to be able to acknowledge it's not working and move on to the next. We are deeply engaged in that process of performance based budget, we can always do better, we will be doing better. I think all of us have committed to that efficiency committee and to performance measures. And examining the overall impact we're having on the community. But I can't stress enough in hard economic times which we are likely to be facing in the next few years, government must step up. And we have an inverse relationship, the economy, from what most businesses do. When many businesses stop producing in hard economic times because demand for their services goes down, government, demand for government services goes up. And we must meet the challenge. We must meet the challenge efficiently and economically, but we must meet that challenge. So I'm happy that we were able to land on a rate less than what we had last year, but I'm also mindful that there are does mean a real increase in how much an individual pays, but that is because our community is blessedly comparatively wealthy by the state standard, which is real property. That's the standard that the state requires that we use. I wish it were by income, by measuring it by property taxes we use a great deal of the state's wealth in private hands rather than in the government's hands. That's the state's choice. And we are working within those parameters. So I will be voting in favor of this budget. I think it's all the good government we can afford.
>> and judge, I would like to add, if I could, very briefly --
>> we have a motion before us. The motion before us is simply to leave the million dollars for the new financial system in allocated reserve, but to put the newly created positions attached to that in a different department.
>> in the department.
>> we'll be moving to the budget after this.
>> that's fine. And I'm -- yeah.
>> I thought this was fairly routine.
>> yes, it is.
>> all in favor? That passes by unanimous vote. Now back to the budget.
>> now back to the budget, and I think what I would say to the public who is here and to everyone else in the community, that our budget is really a bread and butter type of budget where we provide services to citizens throughout the community. And you are right, Commissioner, it is based on consensus. And whether we all vote for this budget or not, all of the resources are going to be applied to all of the county, and we won't leave precinct 3 out just because he votes against the budget.
>> [laughter] all of his projects will continue to be financed and his citizens will be served and I'm very glad that we're able to do that. On top of that, we also have the million dollars that we have in this budget that we were able to go ahead and set aside. There has to be accountability and I realize taxpayers want accountability from us and that was very keen in my mind when he looked at that proposal. We have to report to people and people have the right to ask us where we spent this money. And so that's very, very important. Talk about telling people the truth up front. And so -- but I would say to the folks who came here today, we really, really worked to make sure that we don't waste any resources. If we allocate money for something, we want to make sure we have accountability for the expenditure of that money. Whether it's positions of the work to be done for the public, whether it's projects that are going to provide services to young people, families, the elderly, you know, we kind of -- we respond to that and we want to make sure that you understand that we do not waste your money. I would really join you in being angry at us if we were wasting money. And I understand, I'm a homeowner. I was also a head of household for many years and I had to carry that load by myself. I'm glad I did. I became stronger because of it. But -- and so I know how important it is to protect our money and your money. So I'm very glad to be able to add my vote to this budget as well.
>> and judge, before we conclude, I appreciate everyone coming here and I think everyone knows what we really try to do as far as dealing with this budget. But when you get your tax bill, I want to you look at it very carefully. And you'll see that there are several categories as far as governmental entities that you'll have on your tax statement, your tax bill. You look at it, you have,, you know, school districts and you have, you know, several, city of Austin, Travis County and just several. Hospital, health care district. And when you look at that, you look -- you pay strict attention to Travis County, and you'll see on that there ths mentioned earlier now before anything even happens we go for the max, the 20% right off the top of your tax bill. We are doing some innovative things and there are more innovative things coming up. We're looking for ways to be more efficient all the time. This is just not new. When I mention triple a rating and you compare to us anybody in the state of Texas as far as the counties, we are right up there and maybe just one or two of us counties that have a triple a bond rating. And that means that you are doing something right to maintain or get a rating like that. So we're very cautious in what we do and there are still challenges. We can always make improvements. I want everybody to know that. Thank you.
>> any more discussion of the proposed budget? Move approval.
>> second.
>> discussion? All in favor? Show Commissioners Gomez, eckhardt, Davis and yours truly voting in favor. Voting against Commissioner Daugherty.
>> judge, could we thank all the departments in Travis County, the auditor's office, h.r., especially rodney and my staff for the yeoman job that everybody put in to get this -- get to this point.
>> leroy, you are stealing my thunder.
>> [laughter]
>> but, you know, we cannot do it alone. The auditor's office is integral.
>> you mean we've to collaborate and coordinate?
>> works very well during the budget process.
>> anyway, we do appreciate all the help and cooperation.
>> absolutely. Everybody deserves credit.
>> thank you.
>> second that emotion.
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Last Modified:
Thursday, August 6, 2009 10:26 AM