Travis County Commissioners Court
November 15, 2005
Item 25
25 is to consider and take agreement on the following,. Avment is agreement with milton reimers for purchase of land in southwest Travis County. B is agreement with hogge canyon springs limited, et al for purchase of land in southwest Travis County. C, reimbursement resolution for the purchase of land in southwest Travis County. D, acceptance of contribution from the nature's conservancy of Texas for expenses relating to the reimers land purchase contract. E is park rules, fees, operating hours and services relating to the operation of Travis County's milton reimers ranch park and pogue springs reserve. F is request to transfer funds from the southwest park reserve and car reserve into the appropriate line items in tnr's fy '06 operating budget. And an added part of this is 25-g, which is to authorize persons to sign closing-related documents for purchases of land.
>> I don't know whether tom wants to brief you in executive session on the contract negotiations, but I think there's probably some stuff going on in the last week that you probably ought to hear from tom about.
>> okay. We'll hear from tom when we go into executive session. And tom can just indicate at the appropriate time what parts of item 25 we should take into executive session. Unless we should take all of it.
>> really just a and b, judge. I値l update you on the at that time stus of the contracts. Status of the contracts.
>> okay. We've just been handed two memos.
>> that is regarding e and f. We would anticipate that if a and b are executed on the -- actually, closed on the 22nd, which is next week, that tnr would pick up the operations of the reimers ranch park on thanksgiving actually, the 24th, and so this is presuming that that is going to take place. First of all, we need to have a set of rules that applied to the operation of the reimers ranch park and the hogge springs. We also need to get direction from the court with regard to the fee schedule. And then also the hours of operation, we would also need to staff it and there has been a budget authorized, but is in reserve at this time in the fy '06 operating budget. There will be an action of the court to take the fund out of reserve and put it into operating line item that we can use to actually start staffing up for the purpose of running the park. So --
>> would it be a good idea, do you think, if, say, 30 days after closing we basically advertise to the Travis County residents that these parks will be open for public visitation. For a charge?
>> we think we are stepping into the shoes of the reimers. It's already an active park. What we are doing is saying we are telling people on the 24th, joy reimers stops managing the park, Travis County starts managing the park, basically status quo, so the rock climbers can still use the rock climbing, the bicycle riders can still come out. People who are now using the park, come on back. The only thing that's changed is the management of the park. And it will be a county park from the trekd forward -- 22nd forward.
>> when do we start charging the five dollar per person fee?
>> they're charging right now. And the question is do we charge -- does the county charge five dollars per person as the reimers are currently charging or does the county want to go to its standard rate, which is eight dollars per car? And that is one of the issues that we would like some direction on today. Five dollars per person versus eight dollars per car.
>> let's think about it. A 30 day sort of open season -- no hunting out here. Open house at the park. [ laughter ]
>> we have no hunting in the park.
>> and we do have one slight difference. We do a slightly different fee schedule related to hamilton pool, which is just right around the corner, correct, charles? It's a per person --
>> it's eight dollars a car.
>> we do cars? I thought we do people.
>> no.
>> okay. I take that back. We were doing people.
>> the reason I mention that too is that amazingly I had no idea that this land was there and wouldn't have had the county not become interested in acquiring it. And when I talk with different people across the county, especially those that don't live in southwest Travis County, and I try to explain how to get there, it's almost like telling them to go to -- to go to another country. But with a 30-day, hey, go out and take a look at it, it's beautiful land, and I think 30 days is it's just open, drive out and see it, and I guess we would staff it because somebody has got to control traffic. I think it would be a good gesture. I have no idea knowing whether 10 people would take advantage of that or a thousand, but at least we would make the offer. And I think try to encourage people to go see it.
>> I think we need to visit with our customers out there of knowing, because especially the wind surfers. When you say it's eight dollars per car, they're usually in their own car by themselves, not car pooling. So that really becomes a per person charge so. We need to figure out and maybe visit with the reimers and go see who is going out there. Are most people coming in per vehicle, in which case going to a vehicle charge would actually mean less money they'd have to spend, or are people basically, like a rock climber, are they by themselves, in which case going from five dollars a person to eight dollars for their car and they're the only ones in it, that would actually be a stunner to say, oh my goodness, they took it over and already jacked me up three bucks. So I think we need to have a clear understanding as to what we need to do and not do something because that's what we do everywhere else. We need to learn who our coup clients are out there and be expensive to all that.
>> judge, I think you brought a good point up also as far as trying to tell folks exactly how to get to this new acquisition, park acquisition that the voters have graciously given us the authority to do this past bond election. Is there -- I知 asking staff. Is there any -- is there a duplication on Travis County -- a depiction on Travis County media, channel 17 or anything else, of how we can get to this location? Mapwise? In other words, someone says I壇 like to get there. I壇 like to go and see for this 30-day -- judge said open season, but 30 day revisitation to this new acquisition that Travis County has just acquired. I壇 like to see what that investment is all about, I壇 like to go out there and take a tour. Is there anything that we can assist the residents of Travis County in going to take a little peek at what we've done.
>> we don't is anything on channel 17, but we are currently updating the website. And it's -- the directions will be very similar to what you have at hamilton pool because it's just down the road from it, but we will have a link on there with pictures and information on it.
>> when?
>> you know, I知 hoping that we will have that up and running before we actually close on this deal.
>> okay.
>> so before it opens to the public, it becomes the county property, we're going to have information available for the public.
>> so a person can get to -- what's the website?
>> the county website, www.traviscountytx.gov. Did I get it right?
>> whatever. Have a link to it and you will know after closing this deal tweel show an actual depiction, folks can come anyplace in the county and they can' take a peek at what we've got out there and they can do that. And you will have that up at the closing --
>> before we take position of the property.
>> okay.
>> in all honesty, I don't think that's a good idea. Why don't you wait until we close first.
>> you said before we take possession of the property.
>> before we open it to the public. How's that? Does that work for you?
>> he said it's not a good idea, but I said it was. Do you see what I知 saying? [ laughter ]
>> don't count your chickens before they hatch.
>> joe and I went out there and it was rather difficult to access the park.
>> we went to the hogge tract when you and I went. The reimers tract actually has a ca leach road -- caliche road to the park.
>> is sightseeing a park recreational activity?
>> we have what we are recommending -- the reimers is an active park and if people go to the hogge springs, we ask them to set up a tour with the park staff. We have not yet established a management plan, there are some natural resources area that we don't want to get trampled down. We're saying it has public access, but we're saying let's arrange that by arranging the tours. And then on the larger back side of both tracts you've got about 1200 acres of open territory there. We'd ask the court not to open that to visitation at this time because of just the issue of managing people just randomly going off into open spaces. You could actually get lost. But --
>> I don't have any problem with a tour, but that is not on the list of, I guess, activities in the backup. I知 thinking when I went out there I just really went to see. And I知 sort of suggesting ing that if members of the public were to go and look around, they would be amazed. And whether they participate with any of these -- any strenuous activity, unless you're doing them or real athletically inclined like Commissioner Daugherty, but you may want to go out and just see the parks because they're beautiful enough to see really. So I think we ought to encourage that early on.
>> I think tours would be a good idea. I really do.
>> our goal is to have only about half of the two open anyway, right?
>> that's right.
>> initially. And later on decide what to do with it.
>> our right-of-way czar sitting next to me remind medicine that the hogge tract won't open to the public until next spring. So we're really talking about reimers initially, the 500 acres on reimers.
>> assuming we do get possession of this land, we might think about some kind of a special event next spring when we open up the park system and have a special weekend of really showing off this park. Let's face it, park season has largely ended and there will a lot of people that will still go out there for the special things, but weather is fixing to change, so we might have a real open house, an open house weekend maybe next spring, assuming, mr. Attorney, that everything goes well and we indeed take possession.
>> maybe when white bass start spawning that would be a good time to take the fishermen out there. That's in January, February. The other issue is the hours of operation. Reimers operated the park, opened the gates Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday. What we're suggesting is the county does likewise, at least until January. January is when the bass start running and they start -- the reimers operated on a seven-day a week basis from that point forward. So just so we have enough time to start staffing up and have a handle on the property, we would ask the court to do similarly, open the park Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday and then open for seven days a week starting in January. Otherwise the park rules that we have elsewhere apply in terms of litter, use of alcohol.
>> no guns.
>> collecting artifacts and all that, the same rules apply at these two properties as we would with all our other county parks. We would not have swimming at hogge springs. And nor would we have pets or open fires on the pogue. So we treat the reserve as we would hamilton pool except that the swimming at hamilton pool you actually have a pool that's conducive to swimming. That's not true of the pogue sprijz.
>> these rules are set out in our parks manual.
>> actually adopted by the Commissioners court.
>> that are available to the public.
>> on the website.
>> now, with regard to the fees, what I知 hearing is at least for the first 30 days, no fees whatsoever, just an open house, come see free of charge, come visit, look, rock climb, whatever, but we will not charge a fee for the first 30 days.
>> I think if we advertise it, we ought to do that. And I think we ought to advertise it because I think the public ought to know about it. And if we indicate what the fee will be beginning on what are date we choose, I think litter days after chosing, we'll know that real soon, but here basically is an open opportunity to come out appeared take a look at beautiful, newly acquired county parks and open space. We can put down there this is part of what your bond proceeds bought.
>> jowj, if I could modify that, why don't we take it all the way through the holiday season, say free until January second. That way it also when we go to a seven-day a week schedule. And allow people thanksgiving, christmas, new year's basically use the holidays to come out and look at the property.
>> a holiday gift from our parks department. I like that.
>> and their bosses. [ laughter ]
>> you would think somebody was running for office or something around here.
>> at least three of us. [ laughter ]
>> now, this service is not free. We do have a budget in reserve that will enable us to provide the park staff to manage the park, and we're asking the court to approve the creation of new personnel slots and direct pbo to transfer the southwest park reserve and the carbon reserve into the appropriate line items in fy '06's operating budget.
>> did we already authorize the creation of these funds? We just budgeted the money?
>> we have not authorized the position, the creation of the positions, and the money right now is in the southwest park reserve and then there's also a portion of that as listed here in car reserve for car items. And then I believe there's also going to be a subsequent co request that was discussed previously for vehicles.
>> so if we have a motion to authorize transfer of the appropriate amounts from car reserve as well as the southwest park reserve, we need to authorize creation of how many slots?
>> it is four lots, park ranger, park senior maintenance ranger as well as some temporary dollars for five temps.
>> we'll deal with the co issue at the appropriate time in the future. Okay. That's my motion.
>> second it.
>> so transfer the money and creation of the permanent and temporary slots.
>> we will work with hr on the slot creation and we will transfer the fund as automatics with this motion.
>> discussion?
>> gentlemen, yuj. -- yes, judge. And also after we vote on this, and of course I requested that after closure if they could depict how to get there. You had a good point of getting it on the county website, if that could be included in this motion. But not only that. The voters graciously approved funding for the other parks here, such as northeast metro, southeast metro and also east metro park. And my concern is that can we have that same depiction of how to get to those parks? Because there may be folks that are not aware of where southeast metro park or northeast metro is located. And I don't know -- or east metro. Do we have that same depiction of what those -- those parks, do we already have a depiction to show where they're located?
>> they're on -- east isn't on because it's not open yet.
>> east isn't on there?
>> it's not open yet. When it opens to the public --
>> but the swimming pool is. How can you say that east is -- [overlapping speakers].
>> why don't we vote on this motion and we'll deal with all the parks in general because I think that's a good point. You're saying we need to have that on our website indicating how to get there.
>> how to get there to all of them because folks have put money into them.
>> we may not be posted for that specifically, but I think it's general enough for the poag and rhymers ranch if we were to correctly pick it up, right? We can give directions on that. But the motion is just about the transfer of money, creation of the slots. Let's get that out of the way and then deal with the map.
>> all right, thanks.
>> any more discussion of the motion? All in favor? That passes by unanimous vote. Now let's from the court give dereks on not only new maps for milton reimers ranch park and the pogue springs reserve, but let's treat them the same way we treat all county parks and on the Travis County website there ought to be a simple way to access information that gives directions. Do we have like pictures and something indicating amenities that are available.
>> video logs that we have on many of the parks. We have that information.
>> we need an update of the printed materials in terms of we've got some wonderful park guides that really show everything off. Those need to be updated with all these new land.
>> is there a way for us to see hard copies of what's there or should we access it ourself?
>> either way. We can provide the court all our printed materials so you see what's available and they should give you references of all the websites.
>> we'll give that to staff and then have it back on at the appropriate time to review those. Maybe give us an opportunity to refresh what we have there.
>> so that was e.
>> that was e and f. And I think the other items, c, d and g really relate to a and b. You can't very well deal with those until you've dealt with the core issue of the contracts. And so I think you probably should hear from tom first in executive session on the status of those contracts and then we can come back with all the rest of it.
>> on d do we have the specific amount in hand? D is for acceptance of contribution from nature's conservancy. Do we have it in hand or are we simply saying let's accept it when they give it?
>> the contract provides for up to $100,000. If you wanted to move to accept up to $100,000. It's not nailed down precisely because it depends on mr. Lou's actual expenses that haven't been calculated to the penny yet, but the contribution is capped at $100,000, so we know it won't be more than that.
>> and that's the conservancy's commitment, right?
>> right.
>> okay. Commissioner Daugherty believe moves that we accept up to $100,000 from them.
>> second.
>> any more discussion? All in favor? That passes by unanimous vote. And we'll pull the others off in executive session when we get there. Anything further at this time on this item?
>>
>> [one moment, please, for change in captioners]
>>
>> ...we will take up the rest of 25 in executive session this afternoon.
>> do we need to vote on --
>> actually the executive session now.
>> do we need to vote on the $100,000.
>> we did.
>> it was unanimous.
>> approval.
>> yeah.
>> right.
>> I believe that brings us to executive session.
The Closed Caption log for this Commissioners Court agenda item is provided by Travis County Internet Services. Since this file is derived from the Closed Captions created during live cablecasts, there are occasional spelling and grammatical errors. This Closed Caption log is not an official record the Commissioners Court Meeting and cannot be relied on for official purposes. For official records please contact the County Clerk at (512) 854-4722.
Last Modified:
Wednesday, November 15, 2005 2:56 PM