Travis County Commssioners Court
April 13, 2004
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Item 5
Number 5 is to consider and take appropriate action on fy '04 funding requests and basis for Texas parks and wildlife grant application for land acquisition for the balcones canyonlands preserve. Good morning judge, Commissioners, john kuhl, environmental officer.
>> john.
>> basically the item before you today, item 5, having to do with the grant is just our preliminary conversation with the court.
>> thank you.
>> primarily regarding what we perceive to be as the priorities for acquisition. Some of the conversations that we've had with the fish and wildlife service and others. As you have become familiar with, this is the section 68 cp, conservation plan grant money that we apply for every year and have been luckily very successful in receiving moneys over the years to the tune of I guess more than $30 million for this program.
>> 37.
>> 37 is that? I instant -- I stand corrected. So you can expect to see this when we get in a little bit finer tuned form --
>> it's on for next Tuesday [indiscernible]
>> just wanted to kind of kick-off with an initial conversation like I said about the priorities and where we are headed with this. I would like to just go around and turn it over to [indiscernible] elliott the environmental manager for the project and we'll take it from there.
>> I just passed out to you is the selection criteria that we have been using in these grant applications for the last few years. And it includes a number of things. Quality of habitat, the willingness of the land owner to sell the property, affordability of the property, availability of funds, location of property, used to be within the preserve boundaries, we look at whether it's contiguous to other bcp land and habitat, degree of threats from development, manageability, accessibility, u.s. Fish and wildlife concurrence and the ability of the landowners to deliver clear title. The fish and wildlife service gives us what they consider their highest biological priorities and then we go into our grant application and consider all of these things and then make a recommendation in our proposal. So what -- what we have on second page of this is the -- the recommendation that we have in the draft grant application, we are looking for your guidance today or concurrence. This will also -- this will reach knew final form next Tuesday. These are the -- these are the properties that we have letters for this year that we have proposed to include in our fy '04 grant application. In the order that we proposed to submit them in our proposal. What you can see is that -- that we are asking -- the total cost of acquiring these would be about $45 million, that's $45,000,994. Therefore our federal funding request would be $34.4 million. A note about how we come up with price, we have always used the owners asking price, we don't presume value in advance because we don't have the appraisals on this property until after the money is approved. We could actually appraise them in advance, but then we would have to redo the appraisal later, this is how we have handled it so far. So the asking price, as you might think is sometimes, you know, it's what the owner would like to get for it and we don't necessarily expect that these properties would appraise at that. There could be money left over. But it is our starting point in our federal funding request.
>> what's included in associated costs?
>> associated costs include the cost of an appraisal and appraisal review and environmental site assessment, the title policy, the land plan, those kind of -- those kind of costs associated with the transaction.
>> how many more acres do we need to complete the -- what was the bccp but is now the bcp? Pretty soon will be the bp? [laughter]
>> yeah. The b.
>> I think we are down to -- you have it.
>> section 2, you have your backup, handles or attempts to handle that. We are right at 3,560-acres still lacking with I guess the 851-acres currently in the [indiscernible] acquisition phase and 839 proposed for fy '04. Now, one of the things that you need to understand is that this isn't all about acres and sometimes we forget that. There are also specific cave features that are mentioned in the permit by name. There are 62 of those that have to be acquired or otherwise protected in the process. So sometimes these features are located in pricey areas, number four on the list there refers to one of those properties. We can't get around the fact that those caves need to be protected and adequately protected. So that's sort of one of the realities of the program.
>> I don't believe that I have what you just mentioned.
>> the --
>> what we have is the two-pager that you guys just gave us. I had gotten a thing on --
>> I知 sorry. I was mentioning the table that has the properties in it.
>> here's what would help me. I don't have to have it for today, if I get in it the next month or so it would be good for me. I guess that I would like to see an overview of this program, a projection of when we think it will be done. I never thought it would happen overnight, but I知 not sure that I thought it would go on forever. [papers shuffling - audio interference] required already, particularly parcels that we need to do something for acquisition or no, then I guess we ought to know that. Federal contribution, county contribution, overview like that basically.
>> > sure.
>> the other thing is that I have asked from time to time, I guess that we have discussed it, the possibility of county reimbursement at some point during somebody's lifetime, whether that's realistic or whether the answer to that is no. I mean --
>> reimbursement for o and m associated with managing the property or salaries or specifically --
>> any and all, reimbursement of anything. Whatever the answer is I can live with it. If the answer is unclear because it's contingent upon several things happening, just indicating those would be helpful.
>> would you like to receive this in the format of a -- of a work session or do you just need an overview memo or what --
>> I had in mind a real, real short memo of bullets.
>> okay. Got it.
>> believing the -- something the county judge could read and not misinterpret.
>> judge, a good portion of what you just asked for is already compiled, Commissioner Daugherty and I were in washington d.c. A little more than a week ago, and we were doing exactly what you talked about there, [indiscernible] interior, as to where are we, where are we headed, how much more, what are the contingent factors. We always in fact it's on the printer right now, once the d.c. Trip is complete, get a copy of that annual report to the interior to members of the Commissioners court and to the Austin city council. [papers shuffling - audio interference] our partners in this venture.
>> how many pages is that?
>> it's not bad. We actually got it down to what, about 15, but the [papers shuffling - audio interference] you can look at it.
>> it's those two page that's I知 looking for.
>> several of those include graphics, though.
>> there's a great map that just shows exactly where we are at. But just to update everybody, we had an excellent meeting in washington d.c. They didn't -- we were previewing them in terms of these numbers that are here actually some of these numbers thankfully have come down since the trip to d.c. Related to the folks who are not looking at a fee simple purchase, but purchase a [indiscernible] easement which would be much more affordable and gets you to the same place in terms of protection [indiscernible] they weren't freaking over some of these numbers (microphone cutting out).
>> these numbers represent '04 projections?
>> I知 sorry?
>> these numbers represent '04 projections, right?
>> for the grant?
>> federal share, county match, [indiscernible] costs,? Other things. But what aim looking for is -- what I知 looking for is from the beginning to now, from now to the projected end, two pages and one map.
>> good map.
>> okay.
>> so this is on for next week in terms of the actual application for the section 6 grant funds?
>> that's right. The full application. Heading your way soon.
>> you are looking for approval of this list today? If we try to acquire the tracts of lands in this order and if one -- if we were unable to acquire one -- there is a reason to go for the next one --
>> I want you to understand that this is a dynamic program and things do come on to the market that we are not predicting sometimes. So we are typically able to have some flexibility with the fish and wildlife service, this is what we hold out to the public is our sense of priorities. Keep in mind, too, that the u.s. Fish and wildlife service will review this grant application and sometimes they give us feedback that requires a few modifications to it. So there may be a few edits still to come.
>> the proposal itself is due in washington on may 5th, between now and may 5th we will be in those kind of discussions with the fish and wildlife service and the parks and wildlife department about the proposal itself. It will be fluid until it finally goes to washington.
>> Commissioner Daugherty approve as recommended ?
>> yes, there are some numbers that are 17 acres, $7.5 million.
>> that's their asking price.
>> that's their asking price, oh, good.
>> it has come down.
>> let me take a deep breath before I do this [laughter]
>> another thing that we might adhere is that this list is every -- all of the willing sellers that we have. Now the fish and wildlife service in the past we've asked for 15 million around we received 4 million, one million, two million, as high as 14.4 million.
>> [indiscernible]
>> so you know we aren't necessarily expecting to get this entire grant this year, but this does reflect all of the properties that we could proceed on if we had the funding to do so.
>> is there a time line, a time limit on when we must proceed given the conditions of maybe what is asked for as far as the amount? Are there any -- anything that governs to say hey we tried do the best we could as far銛 as this is concerned however we can't, blah, blah, blah, blah and on what actually governs and guides us as far as --
>> I believe we have up until 2016 to complete this preserve and we are hoping to beat that deadline by quite a few years.
>> okay. Okay.
>> that's the terms of our regional plan.
>> that is the term, okay.
>> good to know that.
>> so move.
>> second.
>> motion does not include the approval of the price asked, right?
>> I知 still breathing on that. I mean -- [laughter]
>> any more discussion? All in favor? That passes by unanimous vote.
Last Modified: Tuesday, April 13, 2004 5:54 PM