Travis County Commissioners Court
February 14, 2006
Item 10
10, consider and take appropriate action to discuss, approve or take any appropriate action on the skeetmatic design for the transportation and natural resources, tnr east side service center.
>> good morning. I壇 like to go ahead and brief you about our project called the tnr east side center. Phase one, schematic design. We have completed the schematic design and we're asking the court for the approval so we can move forward with the project. Just a little background on this project, back in October 27, facility management presented this project to the court, and this project's campus for tnr east service center. This project consolidates services functions currently spread out over the eastern of Travis County in precinct 1 and precinct 4. The campus will consist of nine structures to be built in phases over the next two years. What you're going to hear today is about only phase one, but phase two and three will be continued during the design when we're doing the construction of phase one. So two years from now we should have that campus built. The fleet services, the fleet service building and the administration public assembly building and the crew service building are in phase one. This is number one, two and three. Phase 2 will have the warehouse and sign shop and fuel pump buildings. And phase three will have the vehicle wash bay, the heavy equipment covered parking and the storage buildings, a small one, about 200 square feet. We are on schedule as far as a design is concerned. I have one little reservation about the funding I will share with you down the road that affects schedule. Second is we are at this time under the budget. We requested it and it was approved. I have my staff here and we would like to present to you the schematic design of this building -- those three buildings, phase one. And go ahead, take it, please.
>> okay. Is this turned on? Great. This is the fleet services building. I beg your pardon?
>> is this television on for some reason? Is somebody waiting on this for a presentation this morning?
>> [inaudible - no mic].
>> will we do great harm if we turn it off and then turn it on back then. At my age I知 easily distracted, and it going on and off. It's not just on. It's kind of going on and off and every time it does I知 looking at it. Turn it to where it faces the wall. I知 a little bit irrelevant race I believe in my -- irascible in my old age.
>> thank you. That was crowding me.
>> cometion ergo on -- Commissioner Gomez and I can look at it now. [ laughter ]
>> can we have it where it faces the wall now? Thank you.
>> I want to introduce the fleet services building to you all. This is at one eighth inch equals one foot. I just wanted to make it clear this is a very large building. It's important to know that each of the three buildings we'll show to you are in the same scale, so you will get an idea of the relative sizes. Just as an introduction I want to mention that these three buildings we anticipate -- this building will be the most complicated, the largest, most expensive and it's important that we begin it first so that all the buildings can be complicated at this time. If we start this last, it takes us out of our schedule. Since we presented the conceptual design, we've had a number of user meetings and we've made some modifications to this plan. We've begun incorporated some osha requirements, other technical requirements. We will continue to develop that code research, hazardous materials controls, those sort of code related issues as we move into construction documentation, but we have completed the design in terms of user requirements. And we are here to get your approval for those user requirements, and as you can see from your exhibit, the users have approved this scheme. Do you have any questions about the fleet services building that I can answer?
>> we would like the public administration and assembly building. We got a lot of input from tnr about the public uses of this space. One of the major issues that we dealt with during the schematic design phase was the fact that this will be open to the public, this is a private space; however, when this space is filled with people it could hold 150 chairs, it could hold another 50 people standing. At that point the restrooms that are set aside for the administrative building will be needed by the public assembly area and we redesigned this administrative building to make it possible for these restrooms to be made available to the public at a time when this building is shut down for business. It is now a secure connection to facilities on both sides of this lobby. We think this is a huge improvement in the useability of this building. And it also helps keep the tnr administrative building more secure. It allows them to control access without denying access to restroom facilities.
>> so the capacity for the persons in the community that will be using this building, you mentioned that it was 150 persons, but it ranged from 150 to 300 persons. Now, would that all be persons that would be able to sit or would they be standing and sitting within that range of 150 to 300 persons? In that space.
>> we've designed for 150 persons seated.
>> for sitting.
>> for sitting. With additional space for standing, or you could remove all these chairs, we have storage for chairs, and have it all standing. It is necessary for us to design for its maximum possible use, so we've designed to have restroom facilits acceptable for 300, a full house.
>> okay. I just wanted that clear. Okay. Thank you.
>> thank you for listening.
>> women architects.
>> thank you. You just get it.
>> the break down in this space is approximately 5,000 square feet for the administration, approximately 340 -- excuse me, 3400 square feet for the public assembly space. The public lobby by itself is 780 feet. There are size requirements for public lobby for overflow space for exiting. We are still developing our code issues for that. We want to continue to develop an enclosed outdoor area in the back here that we intend to be part of the amenity. The purpose of this public amenity space is in addition to its public uses to be able for rental, and with that in mind we want this to be a desirable space and we've added this outdoor courtyard to the back of it to be accessible from public assembly and from lobby and from the administration area.
>> what are we doing about security, though? Has that been -- I know maybe this is the schematic design, but what are we basically doing about security?
>> I can talk a little bit about it, security architecturally. I can say that we've designed this building to have a controlled access here. This will be the public entry right here. This is the only public entry. This will be the employee entry for tnr. This will be a locked door. This will be keyed. As we go further into construction documents, we'll determine how we want that access to be handled, but right now there's a single entry. If you look at the public assembly you will see a lot of doors leading out. Those are emergency exit doors. You don't have -- there's no -- there's no requirement for the public to be able to enter through those doors, only that they be able to exit.
>> exit, all right.
>> yes, sir.
>> okay. Thank you.
>> I think I知 going to move on to the crew services building now.
>> since we have that up, what about park something how many parking spaces do you have? Is that on the one we just took down or the one you put up?
>> it was actually shown better on the conceptual plan. We're going to put that right back just for a moment and you will see that the parking here -- this is the public assembly portion of that building and here's parking. Here's the administrative side, and there's additional parking. We anticipate that the employees will predominantly park here first and that the public will predominantly park here because this is where we're placing the flag pole and the easy to identify entry tower.
>> thank you.
>> and the total number of parking spaces is?
>> I have forgotten that number. Does anybody remember? About 150. Maybe 175.
>> 175?
>> yes, sir.
>> so on a day that we have the 300, we hope they car pool.
>> we hope they car pool, yes. Yeah.
>> [one moment, please, for change in captioners]
>> we have it striped off. Most of our service centers are this way. Help -- helps with the bb and -- the ebb and flow of traffic in and out.
>> please forget about compact spaces, nobody owns one anymore. People will just take two, you might as well mark them like we did out at northeast park, which encourages people to take more in your vehicle.
>> do we anticipate the public coming to this building.
>> yes, ma'am.
>> we have built that in. The parking area, you anticipate the public come in during the day, you know typically what they do now. You know with questions that are coming from meetings or any sort of thing. And I think they'll have a -- have a real good vantage point coming into the front of the drive, seeing where the buildings are, we will have the front entry with the flag poles and it will be a nice entrance for them.
>> right.
>> we get lots of folks coming into the west side service center in terms of there are meetings scheduled there that have nothing to do with county business.
>> we have a lot of public, you know, ingress, egress. I think this will be real good vantage point for them to come in.
>> the public will enter the site through here, they will be coming up a hill and they will be able to see the flag pole and the main entry tower right here. We already discussed a monument sign that will help people to understand, their way finding. We anticipate this will be marked off for service vehicles. The public will follow this sign and enter right here.
>> is that off of blue bluff or 969.
>> this is off of 969. We anticipated that the blue bluff entrance will be the service entrance for the heavier vehicles.
>> back on the parking. The layout is so flexible that you can add on any time, you know, we need -- in case we are short of parking, this way or that way.
>> yeah.
>> so ...
>> okay.
>> parking rules.
>> parking and restroom. Absolutely true.
>> this is the crew building. Again it the same scale -- it's the same scale as the other buildings that you have seen, emphasize this is a small building, has a very important function. This is where the crew meets every day. When we talked about the design of this space, we decided that the smart thing to do was to make it as -- as wide open as possible. If it's a rainy day, there could be as many as 100 road and bridge personnel. This is sore of the a locker room but nice enough to roll everyone. On nicer days this is a covered porch, they could stand indoors or out. The doors could be held open, it works. It's restrooms, showers, janitor, vending, storage of equipment, two manager's offices. This is a very simple building. We thought that we would get this started right now. It has a significant restroom, so that makes it something that we want to get moving on. But this won't take as long as the others. This is the smallest of the --
>> the restrooms are they portable?
>> this building is intended for the road and bridge crew.
>> how many women do we have on the crew?
>> altogether on all of our sites we have probably got about six and we made these restrooms fairly large for -- to act daylight male and female along with showers -- to accommodate male and female along with showers.
>> how many men do we have on the crew.
>> automatic of those three locations probably about 90.
>> we need to get more women there.
>> I have already had that discussion with don.
>> we're trying. [laughter]
>> don, do you want me to talk about some of the discussions that we held about the restrooms here? We are very aware of the imbalance in numbers. This job being what it is, there's no telling when this will change. It may not. Where the wall here could be fairly easily relocated. We designed this to code, code assumes that it's 50 men, 50 women and that we know that there's not -- that's for the anywhere near the case. We put in an extra journal for the men's if we don't have any -- an extra urinal for the men's, we would move this wall over f. A code inspector were to come by say you don't have the right numbers, we could move that wall back, but they don't make you move it back until you have those numbers. That's a discussion that I致e had with the city before. What's important is that if we had 50 men, 50 women, we would be able to be compliant with minimal delay and disruption. So we designed for that flexibility knowing that that issue could change from where it is now.
>> do our employees now use showers?
>> we have showers, judge, but -- but it's rare unless the -- if for whatever reason they might get really dirty. It's pretty rare. Some of them have second jobs that they go to, they take a shower before they go to a second job. But you want to have them just in case. I think that it's a benefit that these employees really need, when they are out there sometimes they get really hot, dirty, sweaty, they need that amenity.
>> they also need to use it, though. Right?
>> all --
>> I知 all in favor of showers, if they are not used it's just a waste of space.
>> they are used. I知 not saying they are not used by all 80 or 90 of them every day. It's not like a football locker team.
>> but used enough to build and pay for.
>> they are used enough definitely, definitely.
>> Commissioner Daugherty were to sit out there 30 days, in the summer, you know, every now and then an employee would --
>> every day during the summer, judge. I would say, you know, wintertime a little bit slower, but when you start hitting April through October, they are in use.
>> okay.
>> move --
>> my questions about this. In terms of the sizing, like I知 single focused today. But it's important. The sizing of these facilities, you use the word that it's more like a locker room because that's really where a lot of folks it's just about being able to change clothes, to have the hooks and things up so that they could --
>> yeah.
>> change out, swap out the dirty boots, put on the boots that they are going to wear in -- when they drive their vehicles, it's really to make sure that there's space to do it, not like you are trying to do it in the bathroom, which using our building as an example is a horrible place to try to do your business.
>> that's right.
>> change clothes.
>> yeah. Excuse me. These lockers are designed for bench space for the individual who need them. Typically you are right, sit on these benches and change from one pair of work boots street shoes, on and off jackets, that sort of a thing.
>> the other question that I had, is have employees looked at these plans to be part of the -- of the planning for, you know, to serve their needs?
>> we've had the -- the supervisors and crew leaders look at these I guess we have -- we haven't passed around to the rank and file per se, but we've had a lot of input from quite a few employees.
>> let's include the rank and file.
>> okay.
>> part of the --
>> not a problem.
>> of the building. They are going to use it, so if we could make sure to do that now, not later. We forgot to add some things.
>> yeah.
>> okay. So -- [indiscernible] are you wanting to [indiscernible] for the rank and file.
>> before we do that, where are we going to put the water so that people who need to still come by and fill up their containers can do so?
>> probably at the front, the drive in. Where we will have a -- you see the drive-in service facility right here? It would be in that area.
>> yeah. That's not part of this phase, but the primary reason is that it won't take two full years to construct it.
>> all right.
>> don --
>> we need to do that for indigent families who need to -- to fill their small containers. I know we are not in the business to -- to address commercial users need for water, but this is for -- this is for indigent families who live out in the unincorporated area.
>> yeah.
>> and what about the -- the fire of esd 4, who wanted to -- to be included in this facility? It's not possible right now?
>> I知 not aware of -- of those negotiations.
>> I think don --
>> don, I知 working on something else [indiscernible] let me ask this question. How long would it take to -- to fulfill Commissioner Gomez's request to -- to allow the rank and file to -- to look at this particular scem cat tick design -- schematic design. How long would that take?
>> we can provide that information to the employees first thing in the morning. Bev plans, we could gather, you know, asap, let them look at it, give us their comments. Any of the decisions that we've had with them in the safety meetings about this, the layout, all of them, like I said all of them are aware of what we have planned and they recommend tomorrow.
>> they are pretty much up to speed.
>> yes, sir.
>> as far as what we are doing here now.
>> yes, sir.
>> I want to make sure -- make sure no one is left out.
>> employees have been out there helping us clear brush, aware of our plans, we have talked about this facility for months with our employees, our plans, what we want to do, how it would be combined. Included in all of the discussions what we are moving out there, what we are going to be moving into the facilities that they will have and they are extremely excited. Like I said they wish we could get in tomorrow.
>> that's -- if that's satisfactory with Commissioner Gomez, I don't minds moving approval today. If it's anything left out with rank and file maybe needing over rank and file members maybe needing to see this.
>> this -- this -- this schematic, I guess you call it, plan that you see here is posted out at satellite [indiscernible] as we speak. All of these -- these specific details, I think that you had one of the specific buildings building, they have seen a preliminary such as this. We have talked about it as don said many times in the -- in the safety meeting, it's been put out. If you see anything different or if there's something that you need now is the time to bring it forward. That's been months and months ago. So -- so if don said at that time we were told if you have anything, if you have a problem speaking or whatever, talk to your crew leaders, because those guys are out there, those crew leaders have been out looking at these things very closely to answer your question Commissioner has each individual put an eyeball on these, no. But I assure you each of the individuals have some sort of input to this out of our group. We have been talking about this for a long time, they have been working on it for a long time, looking forward to it for a long time. Even the mechanics. So -- so I think we met with them not too long, I know I spoke with some for the too long ago. But she said, too, if there's something drastic, we can change it now. We haven't, but we have to have a plan to start with. If you all approve these plans, then that will give me something even more concrete that I can go out and say look this is what we have approved. If you see any problem, we will take care of it.
>> probably just the general idea of where you're going and just come back with some changes that the users and the rank and file certainly are users, if they have questions to bring them back within a reasonable period of time. But for -- for you know you move forward because we don't want to get down the road and then have somebody come up all of a sudden trying to avoid all of that as much as possible. So -- so I would be -- I値l second your motion to owe to see move forward with the general idea with the proviso that -- that it interchanges. Come back. Quickly.
>> this is not the end of the presentation. We will come back once to -- once that the plan has been fully developed you know along and for your approval also before doing anything in the construction. So today it would be like this at a schematic design, we get more input from the rank and file guys you know who do [indiscernible] and if any major changes we will bring it forward to your approval. Any minor we can go ahead and do it automatically. We will move the project forward.
>> uh-huh.
>> two other things. I had consultations as well with chief smith. I really tried to steer him to what would be an amazing town hall facility, rather than something separate that they could be one of those users like the general public in terms of a facility that would be built for the community, have the kitchen facilities, have the restroom facilities, have the parking, they can be one of those folks rather than something separate, apart, not really part of -- of this facility. The other thing that I wanted to ask is will we have any kind of -- because space is so large in the town hall, I will call it a divider curtain for lack of a better phrase. So that some space that is pretty large could actually have two smaller groups meeting at the very same time.
>> that was never -- that wasn't part of my initial program. So I haven't incorporated that into this so far. If we chose to do something like that, that would have some fairly -- you would have to preserve and protect access to the -- to the exits. Access to the restrooms. Even if it was divided into half. The only way that I can think of is to divide it this way. It's a bit awkward. This was not planned with that in mind.
>> we can put, you know, the construction to make this -- the two rooms you know right there, put like an accordian wall, movable walls, we could do that, also. One of the things that we did add with was some training, on one side we were able to to incorporate a smaller room, a training room to fit anywhere from 8, 12, 14 folks, maybe a computer area, learning center, of this the intention of that side room, so we do have a room off to the side that we can address smaller groups and -- and a training environment.
>> yeah. Their groups are I think up to 20 cadets, you know. It is a classroom setting, we are talking 20 people, so 8 to 10 won't do it. But certainly the much larger room is something that they could. So I have tried steer them into what we're trying to do as opposed to something separate that would be costly.
>> fleet services training would be a sufficient size for that.
>> we have another in the fleet services area, we have a larger training room in there, also.
>> there you go.
>> that's large enough for 20, easily.
>> there you go.
>> I guess with the motion, hearing all of the other concerns that were brought up, ed rodgers stated this was just a schematic design, significant changes that we feel need to be made then I guess we can do that, those particular issues at that time. So -- so, judge, I would like to -- to again move approval of this particular item 10, with those particular interests.
>> seconded by Commissioner Gomez.
>> now, the backup says that $1.74 million came from t.n.r. Fleet inventory reduction. That amount is in the Travis County treasury right now. I have a little problem here I need to talk to you about. We have budgeted $4.2 million, there's about $1.74 million supposed to be, came from the t.n.r. Fleet inventory reduction, that's supposed to be available for us to use. Well, I can tell you this -- this time that for the last two weeks, I cannot have access to that fund so the project has been delayed two weeks. I知 moving with this project on a fast track. Any time lost I can -- I have to -- I have to adjust for that at the end. What I知 trying to say is this, I知 trying to hire an engineer to help us move forward as to the structures and the [indiscernible] and -- the question from us to put a -- to put a requisition in the system. But we don't have the fund to put it in the system. So really I need to resolve that issues and move it forward.
>> well, let me ask my question another way then. Where is the $1.74 million? Right now.
>> I don't believe anybody from p.b.o. But I believe that's this the road and bridge fund.
>> so roger you are trying to access it before you proceed.
>> yeah.
>> there is a legal question that has to be resolved with regard to the use of the road and bridge fund.
>> all right.
>> and our lawyers have been given that legal question.
>> they have.
>> and you wonder when the answer will be provided.
>> I think roger is wondering when that answer will be provided.
>> my question is whether we can get that answered this afternoon in executive session. What lawyer is working on this?
>> okay. There's your answer.
>> [indiscernible].
>> no, so are they starting to work on this issue right now or has it been worked on previously?
>> they are working on it right now. [laughter]
>> right now. [laughter]
>> we need to get this next week.
>> yes, sir.
>> is that what you are saying? My other question is who will build the road from the facility to 969.
>> from the campus to 969? I think t.n.r.
>> that's correct. That's correct.
>> that's in your work plan.
>> that's in our work plan.
>> okay. There's a funding issue that remains whoever is working on this john will have the funding issue on next week. Any more discussion of the motion? All in favor? That passes by unanimous vote.
>> thank you.
>> thank you all very much.
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Last Modified:
Wednesday, February 15, 2006 11:17 AM